Recommend Jack Stands?

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

Originally Posted by fomocoforrester

Now why would you say a thing like that?

That was said tongue in cheek.

Originally Posted by fomocoforrester

They just don't see the bigger picture which, in the case of OSHA, is to improve the health and safety of the nation as a whole, and presumeably they are achieving this objective, or they wouldn't be funded at the level they are.

Like all those gov't programs that work so well, huh?

[kythri]

Just out of curiosity, and not that we've seen anything more than a single failure of a ratchet-style jack stand (at least, I haven't seen anything else posted recently) - has anyone actually seen a pin-style fail? Is there any documentation (especially photo documentation) of one failing?

As I said when I started posting in this thread, I didn't have any rational reason to dislike the ratchet-style, as I had never seen anything about them failing, I just wasn't comfortable with the design - and then, poof, nearly instantly, there's photographic failure of a failed ratchet-style jackstand (which I assumed to be HF due to the orange, but was told that it wasn't an HF due to the design).

Talk about reinforcing my opinion.

Given the extreme dislike of the pin-style from several members, I feel compelled to ask my above question.

[fomocoforrester]

Originally Posted by Lookin4'67Galaxieconv

That was said tongue in cheek.

I didn't get that because I don't really understand what a pimpflash smilie means in this context. Perhaps you could explain it to me....

Like all those gov't programs that work so well, huh?

Their all doing just as well as they can taking everything into account.

Dammit Galaxie, your getting me dangerously close to political territory....

[mrholeshot]

Originally Posted by fomocoforrester

And you're both against OSHA - what does that tell you? ......

I'm not against OSHA I'm against Pin style Jack stands. I still havent seen where OSHA disproves of quality ratchet style jack stands. Like I said, Ive had OSHA in my shop and nothing was said about my jack stands and the inspector looked right at them. What your statement says is you like thinking for others

[mrholeshot]

Originally Posted by kythri

Just out of curiosity, and not that we've seen anything more than a single failure of a ratchet-style jack stand (at least, I haven't seen anything else posted recently) - has anyone actually seen a pin-style fail? Is there any documentation (especially photo documentation) of one failing?

As I said when I started posting in this thread, I didn't have any rational reason to dislike the ratchet-style, as I had never seen anything about them failing, I just wasn't comfortable with the design - and then, poof, nearly instantly, there's photographic failure of a failed ratchet-style jackstand (which I assumed to be HF due to the orange, but was told that it wasn't an HF due to the design).

Talk about reinforcing my opinion.

Given the extreme dislike of the pin-style from several members, I feel compelled to ask my above question.

Now while I don't have photo documentation I have seen a pin style fail. It was a cheap one and it sheared the pin. My big OTC truck stands are pin style but it is a quality stand. Ive never seen a ratchet stand fail but I'm sure in the case of super cheap stands that those fail as well. I personally don't think the stand failed. It's not broken. The guy said he lifted the car off of himself. That tells me that not much load was on that stand and when the car rocked the tire caught the lever and the car came up and pulled the lever up and the stand came down. Then the car came down on that corner No matter what the guy says I have doubt in my mind but It's doubtful he would accept any responsibility as there is probable some lawyer already on it. I hate it for him but sometimes we do something stupid. I lost all my front teeth to a 9/16 Snap-On wrench that dropped into the fan of a 69 chevy trucks fan blade. 26 stiches and a set of dentures later I saw my error. It's easy to blame the jack stand, it can't defend itself.

[gatewaysysop]

Originally Posted by kythri

Just out of curiosity, and not that we've seen anything more than a single failure of a ratchet-style jack stand (at least, I haven't seen anything else posted recently) - has anyone actually seen a pin-style fail? Is there any documentation (especially photo documentation) of one failing?

As I said when I started posting in this thread, I didn't have any rational reason to dislike the ratchet-style, as I had never seen anything about them failing, I just wasn't comfortable with the design - and then, poof, nearly instantly, there's photographic failure of a failed ratchet-style jackstand (which I assumed to be HF due to the orange, but was told that it wasn't an HF due to the design).

Talk about reinforcing my opinion.

Given the extreme dislike of the pin-style from several members, I feel compelled to ask my above question.

Meh. I own the 6-ton HF jobs and never felt unsafe with them. Still use tires as a backup and the jack too if I don't need to move it out of the way. Have used pin-style in the past but the stands were so shitty I wasn't worried about pin vs. ratcheting, I was worried about the older pin-style stands falling apart. Beefiest ones I could find at the time were the HF ratcheting ones. For me it wasn't about not trusting the pin, it was about the rest of the stand. Pin vs. ratcheting never entered the equation.

Be careful about focusing on a single or small number of failures as an example or "proof" of anything. Hard to draw any reasonable inference about a population (all ratcheting stands) when your sample is that small (and of unknown brand), no?

By the same token, remember the old adage that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. E.g. just because you don't see pictures of pin-style failures on a forum, doesn't mean it hasn't (or won't) happen.

I say pick your poison and play it as safe as you can. Throwing out your jack stands or questioning their integrity because you saw pictures of someone else's horrific failure under uncertain circumstances is just plain silly.

[Bolster]

Well I'm glad I started this thread.

Always gratifying to see everybody feuding like Hatfields and McCoys.

Now I'm thoroughly confused as to whether to go ratchet or pin. Looks like certain death either way.

Mock me if you will, I am NOT buying a HF jack stand, no way! I'm perfectly content to die some other way, just not from a HF jack stand. I mean, I expect my death will be on account of the Chinese at some point, but...just not a jack stand, please.

[Stephenw]

I changed the oil on my wife's Windstar van today. I tried to lift the ratchet release on my HF 6 ton stands with the weight of the van on them. I pulled as hard as I could and they held. I was tempted to try with a prybar, but decided against it.

[gatewaysysop]

Originally Posted by Bolster

Mock me if you will, I am NOT buying a HF jack stand, no way! I'm perfectly content to die some other way, just not from a HF jack stand. I mean, I expect my death will be on account of the Chinese at some point, but...just not a jack stand, please.

In all honesty, I'd have preferred American made, but at the time I couldn't find them and it seems silly to swap them out now. I'd have avoided HF if I could have.

[fomocoforrester]

Originally Posted by mrholeshot

I'm not against OSHA I'm against Pin style Jack stands. I still havent seen where OSHA disproves of quality ratchet style jack stands. Like I said, Ive had OSHA in my shop and nothing was said about my jack stands and the inspector looked right at them. What your statement says is you like thinking for others

I'm not exactly sure how I can think for others, but as I already had to point out to Elroy that I was'nt putting words in his mouth, maybe I'm not making myself clear.

When I say you are against OSHA, of course I'm only saying that in the context of discussing pin type stands against ratchet style stands. How could I possibly comment on your position with regard to OSHA on any other topic, when I havn't a clue what it may be.

The most likely reason that the OSHA guy did not pass comment on your shop stands is because OSHA is not saying they are unsafe, just that they are not as safe as pin style stands, and you are perfectly entitled to use ratchet style stands as you see fit.

This difference in safety levels between the two types is so small that a diplomatic OSHA guy is hardly going to make an adverse comment about your shop full of ratchet stands when they are perfectly acceptable. Especially when he is acutely aware of the risk of antagonizing shop owners unneccessarily.

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

Originally Posted by Bolster

I mean, I expect my death will be on account of the Chinese at some point, but...just not a jack stand, please.

You're killing me!

[WHT]

Yous pays your money and yous makes your choice. Hopefully,people realize that stand construction is a safety issue and they can discuss the matter without calling other posters names.

Look closely at the picture Monte posted. Your life is held by a 1/8-inch area of engagement in many ratcheting stands. Ratcheting mechanism are often cast today and parts can wear and fail much easier than a quality pin stand made from extrusions. Also, it is obviously easier to inspect a pin stand for wear.

If a pin does break on a quality stand with close tolerances (and I have never seen a pin break), the stand will most likely simply jam and not have a total failure as can occur with a ratcheting mechanisms.

[d33pt]

so where can i buy a US made 6-ton ratcheting jackstands with pins as a backup? that would give the best of both worlds. otherwise i'm going to buy the hein-warner 6 tons and 3 tons from tooltopia that was linked earlier.

[nexum1919]

regarding the photo on the porsche forum where the jackstand supposedly just 'let go'

look at the after photo, the handle is awfully close to the tire, i don't know why he did not position the stands with the handle facing other way. most probably, the pawl did not engage with the notches in the drawbar fully because of the handle being held up by the tire. But apparently enough to support the weight for a while, waiting for him to disturb the incredible fine marginal positioning of the pawl...
too_close.jpg

[caper]

Originally Posted by WHT

Depends what you need. But, I have the Norco low profile jack stands (needed for low sports car) and they work very well. And, I wouldn't worry about them collapsing.

The majority of jack stand accidents according to OSHA occur with ratcheting stands. The pin stands are simpler and safer, allowing that you are smart enough to install the pin correctly. If not, you should not be using ANY jack stand.

BTW, its a simple one hand operation. You set the stand height you need/want, check the pin and position under the car with one hand while making sure the base is on a secure footing. Its not exactly rocket science.




Made in U.S.A.
Model 81205
Jack Stands - Pair
Low Profile
5 Ton Capacity
(each stand)


Intended Use
Low profile design in order to support low cars, forklifts and heavy machinery. All stands are sold and intended to be used in pairs.

Features (9 to 16 inches)

* Pin type support column adjusts to four different height positions.
* Heavy duty adjustment pin is secured to stand to prevent loss.
* Handle provides ease of positioning and carrying.
* 9" square base secures and stabilizes load.

These stands are an accident waiting to happen IMO.We have similar ones at work and nobody in the shop will use them.Not because of the pins but because of the flat plate on the base.It makes them very wobbly unless they are on perfectly flat floors.We have eight professional techs in our shop and,to a man,they are all refusing to use this style of stand.(Not to mention my son could weld better than the birdshit welds on them.)We have a mix of ratcheting and pin style stands in the shop(about 30 stands).If any preference I suppose it would be to ratcheting types but we use the pin types as well.The main complaint with the pin type is that usually the pin puts it at the wrong height for what your doing but there seems to be a finer adjustment with the ratcheting style.In twenty years in shops I've never seen either type of stand fail.If a ratcheting stand dropped from under that car it was operator error in my opinion.If the weight is properly on a ratcheting stand it's impossible to bump the release arm and move it.You'd have to lift the weight of the car.If it dropped and the pawl is still in one piece it was operator error,plain and simple.

[coldfusion21]

I have always used the ratchet style stands, usually some china ones, HF or otherwise.

I have never had one deform or fail on me, the ratchet mechanism is simple and i always check to make sure its securely engaged, just like you would with a pin. Ratcheting ones also seem to have a finer degree of adjustment. What would be cool is a ratcheting stand that could be pinned as well.

I like my ratcheting stands, they serve me well for a decent price. I will probably upgrade to a pinned USA stand in the future, just cause.

[Monte]

Ratchet + Pin style in one: http://www.amazon.com/Torin-Double-L...3721106&sr=1-9

[d33pt]

Those torin jack stands just pin the pawl down, so you can't move the lever up. The pin will do nothing if the pawl fails. I was thinking of a pin that goes through the bar.

[X1 Mike]

Originally Posted by Bolster

Well I'm glad I started this thread.

Always gratifying to see everybody feuding like Hatfields and McCoys.

Now I'm thoroughly confused as to whether to go ratchet or pin. Looks like certain death either way.

Mock me if you will, I am NOT buying a HF jack stand, no way! I'm perfectly content to die some other way, just not from a HF jack stand. I mean, I expect my death will be on account of the Chinese at some point, but...just not a jack stand, please.

Pure comedy gold.

I love how you specified multiple times that you wouldn't consider 港货运 but the fanboys insist on talking to the walls.

[Stephenw]

Originally Posted by X1 Mike

I love how you specified multiple times that you wouldn't consider 港货运 but the fanboys insist on talking to the walls.

I have jack stands and a few other things from Harbor Freight, but I'm certainly no fanboy.

Answering questions and participating in forum discussion is not for the sole benefit of the person who started the thread. It is also for the benefit of other forum members who may be reading the discussion.