12pt. SO sockets goin out of style

D9H 90V · Apr 20, 2010

did they quit making fasteners 12pt.? I needed to replace a couple of SO 12 pt. metric sockets today , climbed in the SO truck, handed him the broken 14mm 12pt socket and told him I needed a 16mm also and he hands me a new 14 mm 6pt and a new 16mm 6pt I told him I needed them in 12pt,
Then he searches around his well organized truck and tells me hes gonna have to order them and he'll have them next week , I looked around his truck and didnt see any 12pt. sockets. are 12pt. not that common anymore, mind you they were 1/2" drive deep chrome sockets

chadster1 · Apr 20, 2010

D9H 90V said:
did they quit making fasteners 12pt.? I needed to replace a couple of SO 12 pt. metric sockets today , climbed in the SO truck, handed him the broken 14mm 12pt socket and told him I needed a 16mm also and he hands me a new 14 mm 6pt and a new 16mm 6pt I told him I needed them in 12pt,
Then he searches around his well organized truck and tells me hes gonna have to order them and he'll have them next week , I looked around his truck and didnt see any 12pt. sockets. are 12pt. not that common anymore, mind you they were 1/2" drive deep chrome sockets

12 point is not that common. I only stock a few sizes in 12pt that are common warranty items.

06wt · Apr 20, 2010

i cant remeber the last time i reached for my 12 sockets

Goinlow · Apr 20, 2010

12pt is not very popular among people I know. I can only think of a handful of fastners I'd come across. So I'd rather have 6 point.

D9H 90V · Apr 20, 2010

Thats funny because on alot of the older heavy equipment I operate/work on
they used 12pt.

Do yall think 6pt is better then 12pt when using it on a 6pt. fastener?

Merkava_4 · Apr 20, 2010

Most SO dealers don't stock 12 point sockets unless they have an airport on their route.

chadster1 · Apr 20, 2010

D9H 90V said:
Do yall think 6pt is better then 12pt when using it on a 6pt. fastener?

Oh no, not that debate again.

Adam McLaughlin · Apr 20, 2010

Ugh. No twelve point anything unless you NEED it, that **** just strips....

Adam

Charles (in GA) · Apr 20, 2010

You can tell dealers that have aircraft mechanics on the route, they have 12 pt. I own almost no 6 pt and would need a real special reason to buy one.

Charles

Goinlow · Apr 20, 2010

D9H 90V said:
Thats funny because on alot of the older heavy equipment I operate/work on
they used 12pt.

Do yall think 6pt is better then 12pt when using it on a 6pt. fastener?

I personally always reach for 6pt over 12pt anyday.

Merkava_4 · Apr 20, 2010

Adam McLaughlin said:
Ugh. No twelve point anything unless you NEED it, that **** just strips....

Adam

I've never had any of my 12 point SO sockets strip anything; they fit better than a 6 point Craftsman socket any day.

12 point sockets are for REAL men.

GeorgiaHybrid · Apr 20, 2010

If you plan on using ARP bolts, you might want to reconsider your "no 12 point" stance. I have full sets of both and to be honest, it does not matter which one I grab, they will both break a bolt loose. Never had a Snap-on 12 point round a fastener off because it was a 12 point either.

Snapped the head of the bolt off, yes.....rounded off, no

bgott · Apr 20, 2010

I was a 6 point man until I got a few sets of 12 point in really, really good deals. I also inherited a 12 point set from the '40s, that seems to be all they used back then. In 1/2" drive I have 6 point impacts, 12 point hand driven, works for me.

plinker · Apr 20, 2010

I bought 12pt 1/4" bolts for my front driveshaft retaining strapson my Ranger, OEM was Torx (pain in rear to remove them, simpler to use a socket).

The drive shaft on quite a few Ford trucks use a 12pt 12mm on the bolts.

Heavy trucks (Mack anyway) also use 12pt bolts on the driveshafts and in a few other places.

Hiball · Apr 20, 2010

I tend to use 6pt when most of the time but ive purchased alot of 12pt wright drive sockets lately and i dont see much of a difference when used on 6pt fasteners. In fact i believe they was designed for such a task.

Jeeper · Apr 20, 2010

I was just thinking of ordering a 12pt gearwrench metric to try them out. I come across a few 12pt here and there on my jeep.

tonydanzah · Apr 20, 2010

I have been reaching for my sk spline more than my 6pt lately

mrshaun · Apr 20, 2010

Charles (in GA) said:
You can tell dealers that have aircraft mechanics on the route, they have 12 pt. I own almost no 6 pt and would need a real special reason to buy one.

Charles

you said it.
1/2 of my truck is 12 point and they never go on promo. it *****. no deals to pass on to the guys.
also military vehicles have a few 12 point as well
aftermarket honda parts sometimes come with 12 point.

Jeeper · Apr 20, 2010

Anyone know the purpose of putting a 12pt fastener on something instead of a 6pt? My np231 transfercase has 6pt all the way around the perimeter of the case except for the top has a 12pt. Can't figure out why.

stricht8 · Apr 20, 2010

Merkava_4 said:
I've never had any of my 12 point SO sockets strip anything; they fit better than a 6 point Craftsman socket any day.

12 point sockets are for REAL men.

Real men don't have to overcompensate with 12 points. :lol_hitti

Teken · Apr 20, 2010

Nothing to add here, but where the hell do you guys get the extra emoticons?

Longbob · Apr 20, 2010

tonydanzah said:
I have been reaching for my sk spline more than my 6pt lately

Spline baby! That is where it is at! :bounce:

In all seriousness, I was a 6 pt only guy until I began to drag race and you would be surprised how many 12 pt fasteners are on a race car these days. I think it has a lot to do with ARP.

One thing for sure, you can always use a 12 pt socket on a 6 pt or 12 pt fastener, but you can never use a 6 pt socket on a 12 pt fastener. You can use a spline on any of them including 4 pt. I really like my SK spline sets.

Goinlow · Apr 20, 2010

It'd be nice for us to have a list of some common 12 point bolts.

On vw's the pressure plate bolts are 9mm most of the time. 30mm axle bolts are typcally 12pt also on vw and Lexus/Toyota.

Longbob · Apr 20, 2010

Jeeper said:
Anyone know the purpose of putting a 12pt fastener on something instead of a 6pt? My np231 transfercase has 6pt all the way around the perimeter of the case except for the top has a 12pt. Can't figure out why.

Most often it is due to space constraints on our race cars. You can get more torque on a smaller 12 pt fastener than a 6 pt of the same size (I think). It also seems like you can maneuver a 12 pt fastener/tool in tight places easier than a 6 pt.

BWright · Apr 20, 2010

Adam McLaughlin said:
Ugh. No twelve point anything unless you NEED it, that **** just strips....

Adam

So you only use 12 point wrenches on 12 point fasteners? :headscrat

tonydanzah · Apr 21, 2010

BWright said:
So you only use 12 point wrenches on 12 point fasteners?

Yep, that how I feel about sockets. Wrenches are another story though.

Moose-LandTran · Apr 21, 2010

Teken said:
Nothing to add here, but where the hell do you guys get the extra emoticons?

I have a whole folder in my Photobucket account with extra ones.

Thedroid · Apr 21, 2010

Heavy equipment.I think they're called ferry bolt, and there a lot stronger for a given head size. I see them on a lot of industrial equipment, especially air compressors and

Mugen AP1 · Apr 21, 2010

I'm in hydraulics service and i see a lot of 12 point on Cat pumps and motors. And some small Eaton/Char-Lynn motors have 5/16 bots in 12 point.

Most of my stuff is 12 pont too. You can use 12 point on a 6 point bolt...but not the other way around :thumbup:

My only problem is that the chrome tends to flake on my Snap-on 12 points over the 6 points. Maybe because there are so many sharp angles... :headscrat

arkangel06 · Apr 21, 2010

Funny I handed my dealer a broken 6pt a while ago and he handed me back a 12pt and said its all he had in that size!

Avgas · Apr 21, 2010

Jeeper said:
Anyone know the purpose of putting a 12pt fastener on something instead of a 6pt? My np231 transfercase has 6pt all the way around the perimeter of the case except for the top has a 12pt. Can't figure out why.

Originally, 12-point fasteners were designed for the aerospace industry where fastener are loaded to just 50% of tensile strength and wrenching torques are much lower. When the same fasteners are used elsewhere, we try for 80% to 100% of yield strength by over-tightening them and then problems can arise.

A wrench and fastener form a coupling that transmits the required torque to the fastener. Doubling the number of teeth on the fastener boosts torque transmitting capability by 50% to 70%, but doesn't double torque transmission. Wall thickness, when insufficient, will also cause a socket to split. Current standards don't allow adequate wall thickness to take advantage of the 12-point configuration. and even if they did, the wrenches wouldn't fit in close quarters.

A 50% to 70% increase in strength occurs if the "across flats" dimension is not changed. But the most popular use of the 12-point configuration is to allow a reduced head size. A reduced head size requires a smaller wrench with much less strength.

Richard B. Wright
Wright Tool Company

Here is the link to the article

warmpancakes · Apr 21, 2010

12 point fasteners are used on race cars because you can get a tool on the faster, and they weigh less

jimexcursion · Apr 21, 2010

plinker said:
Heavy trucks (Mack anyway) also use 12pt bolts on the driveshafts and in a few other places.

1/2" on u joint straps and 5/8" on power divider bolts. I think Freightliner may used some 12 point stuff too but I work on Macks 99% of the time.

snapmom · Apr 21, 2010

Six point s/o 1/2 dr. sockets from the 30s and early 40s are very hard to find. Twelve points came out in about 1928-29.

fordbroncodave · Apr 21, 2010

there are maybe a few 12 pt sockets that you really need. i find the 9/16" is common for long hub bolts on pickup trucks, various 3/8" drive sizes for caliper and various 12 point bolts, once in a while i come across 12 point bolts in the intake manifold region. other then that, not common by any means but a whole set in metric and standard is manditory

Moose-LandTran · Apr 21, 2010

Thedroid said:
Heavy equipment.I think they're called ferry bolt, and there a lot stronger for a given head size. I see them on a lot of industrial equipment, especially air compressors and

They're called Ferry Caps.

warmpancakes said:
12 point fasteners are used on race cars because you can get a tool on the faster, and they weigh less

It's not about the speed you get a tool on or the weight. (Like for like, a 12-point will weight more.) It's that you can transmit more torque with 12-point fasteners with a reduced risk of rounding.

BWright · Apr 21, 2010

Moose-LandTran said:
It's not about the speed you get a tool on or the weight. (Like for like, a 12-point will weight more.) It's that you can transmit more torque with 12-point fasteners with a reduced risk of rounding.

Did you read the article avgas posted? It mostly has to do with being able to reduce the head size to get the same amount of torque as a larger 6 point. So a smaller head would weigh less as well. :thumbup:

arkangel06 · Apr 21, 2010

BWright said:
Did you read the article avgas posted? It mostly has to do with being able to reduce the head size to get the same amount of torque as a larger 6 point. So a smaller head would weigh less as well.

This is true where a 6pt would have a large head a 12pt would be the same dia as the shank.

Griff93 · Apr 21, 2010

I've never had a problem with good 12 point sockets stripping anything. Cheap junk is another story. I even have some 12point impact sockets and do use them regularly. I have even used them on 6 point bolts at times and have had absolutely no problems. They are SO/Mac.

Jack90210 · Apr 21, 2010

chadster1 said:
Oh no, not that debate again.

12pt. SO sockets goin out of style

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