Porcelain tile - what preparations I need?

[Domochu]

Hi everyone,

After reading slickgt1 and Jack's garage and how great the tiles have been working out for them. I decided to start planning to lay some porcelain tiles in my own 16' x 20' garage of my house that I bought a year and a half ago.

My concrete floor has been neglected by the previous owner(s). It is a 1971 house and I believe the garage floor has the same age (it's an attached garage). So it has its own problems.

PROBLEMS:

1- The concrete has been crumbling. Some spots feel hollow when knocked on and when I hit the spot hard with a chisel, a 5mm layer of concrete comes off (see pics). What's underneath seems pretty solid though.

2- There are also some cracks that have been filled previously with some repair cement that are starting to crack again (see pic).

3- There are also some less traffic frequent spots with a layer of some old paint (see pics)...

I need your precious advice on what I need to do prior to tiling it with porcelain tiles. Here are my questions:

QUESTIONS:

4- First of all, my floor is slightly slopped through the center of the garage (where the drain is - see pic). Will this be a problem for tiling?

5- Do I need to chip off all the hollow spots before tiling? My guess is yes, so the thinset grabs on something solid

6- Do I need to use a densifier prior to tiling?

7- What should I do about the cracks? Dig out the repair cement and fill with some more appropriate crack fillers (like some epoxy based stuff)?

8- Should I grind off the paint first so the thinset adheres better?

Thank you for your advices.

[Domochu]

Another thing worth mentioning is this garage is currently and will be used for:

- park my car (all year long, canadian winter)
- do some light car maintenance (oil change, tire change/rotation, brake maintenance, etc)

Thanks.

[9GUY9]

I"m going to tag along. I am in almost the exact same situation.

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by Domochu

Hi everyone,

PROBLEMS:

1. The concrete has been crumbling. Some spots feel hollow when knocked on and when I hit the spot hard with a chisel, a 5mm layer of concrete comes off (see pics). What's underneath seems pretty solid though.

2. There are also some cracks that have been filled previously with some repair cement that are starting to crack again (see pic).

3. There are also some less traffic frequent spots with a layer of some old paint (see pics)...

I need your precious advice on what I need to do prior to tiling it with porcelain tiles. Here are my questions:

QUESTIONS:

4. First of all, my floor is slightly slopped through the center of the garage (where the drain is - see pic). Will this be a problem for tiling?

5. Do I need to chip off all the hollow spots before tiling? My guess is yes, so the thinset grabs on something solid

6. Do I need to use a densifier prior to tiling?

7. What should I do about the cracks? Dig out the repair cement and fill with some more appropriate crack fillers (like some epoxy based stuff)?

8. Should I grind off the paint first so the thinset adheres better?

Thank you for your advices.

Hi, thanks for the recognition. First thing I have to say is don't over-think it. Don't forget, if the concrete can take load without crumbling, the the tile will only re-enforce that. Most important thing I have to say is make sure your tile doesn't have air pockets under it. So back butter everything. My main concern about everything in your post is #5 and #7. Read my response below for those two issues. If not for those two things, I would be tiling already.

I numbered your quote above.

1. Don't stress about this at all.
2. Don't worry about this as well.
3. See if the paint is on well. Like you need to to scrape it. If it is stuck on well, you will be able to tile right over it. I did. If you look through my thread, the back half of my garage had old paint. I also just did a porch for a relative right over 1 year old epoxy. This last project has been holding up well so far. It was a chance we decided to take. The slab was old, and was leaking into the garage when it would rain for more than a day. So he epoxied it to seal the porch. The porch is outside by the way.
4. No, it will not give you a problem. I am guessing that you are going to stay with this slope, and not change something.
5. How hollow are we talking about. If you hit it with a sledge straight down, does the sledge break through it? If it does, then yes just hit it with sledge and take out the loose shit.
6. NO densifier is not needed. You actually don't want to coat the concrete more than it is already.
7. Do these big cracks more under load from walking and from car? Test this out. Stand over the crack, have your feet, one on each side of the crack and have your wife drive the car in. If you feel movement, you will need to re-enforce the section, not fill the crack, but get the slab to stop moving. Let us know what your result is here. If you look at my renovation thread, my slab moved. It doesn't move anymore.
8. I wouldn't bother grinding shit. See if it comes off easy with a scraper. If not, just go over it.

[Domochu]

Hey slickgt1,

Thanks for answering my questions and for the numbering my problems/questions, it is a great idea.

I have to give you some history about my slab and how the cracks occurred there. In the area where I bought my house, the contractors may have used a backfill that contain pyrite - Pyrite (FeS2) is a very common mineral. Traces of it are found in the sedimentary rock used to make crushed stone for backfill, in regions where problems of swelling have been encountered. It expands when exposed to moisture over a long period of time.

Prior to buying my house, I had the previous owner did a "Pyrite Test" (if the test has never been done before, it's normal procedure when you buy a house here). Since my house is built on 1 large slab of concrete which includes the garage, the testers dug a 1 feet wide hole in the garage floor to take samples of the backfill to analyze it. That's how the cracks came...they filled the hole with some cement/rocks afterward.

The 1 feet wide hole was dug in the middle/front of the garage. The cracks are 3 fold and in sort of a Y shape that starts from the hole.

Luckily, the analyze showed that there was 0% of pyrite in my backfill.

I'll do the test that you suggested and see if it moves. Sorry for writing so much.

What if it does move a bit? I read on your thread that you drilled holes and dig some re-bars in it... can you elaborate a little more?

Thanks

[Frank The Plumber]

Not opposing anyones point of view just adding my experience.

My experience is this on cracks. If it was not moving it would not have cracked. Tiling over a crack will not keep it from moving even if it was only a shrinkage crack, once it does crack it will move. It will crack the tile, just a matter of when. The tile is for sure weaker than the original concrete which for some reason did crack.

If you wanted to make a little more certain that the stuff will not crack I would saw cut out as much of the crack as I could and try to pin in a much thicker patch pour. Even this will not be 100%, but a lot better than almost for certain that if you do nothing that the tile will crack.

I have seen in some very odd conditions like soft marble flooring where a base material like concrete board was laminated to the concrete. This is like super way out there over kill but I have seen this stuff glued down and screw pinned into the concrete to provide a good stable base on real expensive materials installations.

On this pinning thing, the best example is if you drive on the freeway and see those patches on the road where there are all of those green rebar rods sticking out of the existing cement. They drilled those holes into the concrete to pin the two sections into each other so that they would not move up and down against each other. The pins or rods hold them so that the plane does not shift and cause a surface crack. You would need to replicate this in smaller scale on your own concrete floor to effect a good repair patch across a crack seam.

[Toolfool]

Scrape or grind any loose areas. De-grease and clean the floor. Lay an anti-fracture membrane like Ditra ( http://www.schluter.com/6_1_ditra.aspx ) with thinset. Lay your tile over that. Let your grout cure for at least a week before sealing. All problems solved. Been using this product for years in adverse situations with great results.

[slickgt1]

Ok anyway, those cracks now seem like drying cracks and it was probably not tied in to the original slab. No worries.

They way I pin cracked slabs.

Rent a hammer drill with a 3" or 4" hole saw. It will make your life easy. Drill out holes on any moving pieces of the slab. Do them random spots. Foot apart is more than enough, you can go further apart if you want. Dig out the dirt, or use a shop vac like I did. Break apart the hard fill with a screwdriver and suck it up. This will be the most sucky part of your process. You need about a foot of fill removed. Then drive in rebar, and fill the hole with concrete. You basically now get columns that pin your slab.

Remember my slab section moved a lot. Walking on it too. Almost like it was on a pivot. Pushing 2 years now, 5000lb BMW x5 parked on it every day. No tile has cracked.

I would skip the Dirta as well. It is an unnecessary expense. Yes it will isolate the cracks in your slab from coming through to the tile, but I don't think you will have that problem. I have also not had the opportunity to test it under severe garage use, so I don't know what you can do on it, or how it will hold up with localized pressure on one tile, like a floor jack.

Look at it this way. If by some crazy chance some tile cracks, or a bunch of them crack, replacing them is easy. Not like you have to grind epoxy, clear out your whole garage, nothing. Just break them out and replace. Again, if your slab doesn't move now, it might never move.

Jack laid his tile over cracks without doing anything but filling them in. I didn't even fill them in, just thinset into the cracks.

Here is a pic of what I did on that floor yesterday. Sorry for the mess guys, been a crazy month.

By the way, that crack was somewhere between the first and third row of tiles after the front ramps. Look, no crack still.

[slickgt1]

Oh and use epoxy grout for that long lasting goodness. Plus you won't have to seal anything. I had about 6 liters of transmission oil under there right before I cleaned up and took the pic. And the cleanup was just a bunch of rags with brake cleaner. Yea love the floor.

[Jack Olsen]

My advise is to keep is simple. My pad was in terrible shape. I used a pressure washer on it and used a couple sacks of patching concrete to address the big elevation changes. I have not had any cracks transfer through to the tile and the floor has seen several years and many (modest) earthquakes.

I only disagree with slickgt1 on the grout. It's probably because I'm lazier than he is. In my opinion, epoxy grout is a pain in the neck to both fill and to clean up off the tops of the tiles. Just use a dark color of grout, and don't bother with sealing anything. You can not stain dark brown -- at least, not in a way you'll ever notice. I accidentally used the wrong shade of brown grout when I reinstalled a bunch of tiles with my lift install. You wouldn't ever notice it. It's just the dark lines between the tiles.

I don't often disagree with Frank the Plumber, but I've been told that porcelain tiles are significantly stronger (in compression) than the concrete they're sitting on.

The really important thing is to not install the tile the way bathroom tiles are installed. Like thin wafers of concrete would be, tiles are weak in suspension. You can easily crack them if you apply pressure down and they're bridging any kind of a gap. The key is to double-butter the thinset, which means to apply it to the floor and also to the underside of the tiles. There will always be small air pockets, but you do not want voids -- nothing that will produce that hollow sound when you tap on the tile. It's the method of installation used in bathrooms that gets it in people's heads that tiles are easy to crack.

Here's a video to show something that wouldn't work with bathroom tiles. These are the cheapest tiles I was able to find at Home Depot. They're ceramic, which is not as strong as porcelain.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elJtN6nRlhk

Oh, and here's a picture that showed the first half of my garage right before I put down my tiles. There was about an inch and a half drop off in that front section, where a previous owner had lengthened the garage. I didn't know about self-leveling mix when I did this, so I used vinyl patching mix.

[Frank The Plumber]

I guess if you are doing it for yourself you won't have a suit filed when it cracks. The several I did where for others.

Take my word for it, any guy who is capable of spending to tile his garage floor is going to sue your pants off when it cracks.

[Domochu]

Hey guys,

Thanks for your input on my case. It is much appreciated that you take the time to write up your advices and I will consider them seriously.

Jack and slickgt1, I've seen how great your garage floors are and that's what inspired me to plan this project.

Frank, no suing will happen here. It is for myself. If it cracks, well...bummer for me. However, I'm trying to avoid that... and I guess that's the purpose of this forum's existence. To share knowledge about how to make it right. Thanks for your advice and I will seriously consider pinning down the part of my slab that has cracked.

I've seen Ditra before on this forum. I'm also questioning if it's really needed. We're looking at possibly doubling the cost of the project here with Ditra. It is about 2.50$ a sq.ft.

[LegacyIndustrial]

Jack:

You have guts going under that Porsche with those stands up like that.
I have my vette on the same stands, un-extended and I get uneasy. Yes I know my floor looks poor for a coating guy. The floors get done after I restore the vette!!
76 Jack Pic.jpg

[PT Doc]

Originally Posted by Frank The Plumber

Tiling over a crack will not keep it from moving even if it was only a shrinkage crack, once it does crack it will move. It will crack the tile, just a matter of when. The tile is for sure weaker than the original concrete which for some reason did crack.
.

I'm pretty sure that porcelain is tougher thn concrete. Can anyone confirm?

[Frank The Plumber]

Originally Posted by PT Doc

I'm pretty sure that porcelain is tougher thn concrete. Can anyone confirm?

A 3/8" thick piece of porcelain will be stronger than a 3/8" thick piece of concrete. However...
A 3/8" thick piece of porcelain tile should not be structurally stronger than a 4" thick concrete slab pour. While it is going to be a lot stronger than a piece of vitrified of the same size it still has it's stress limitations. The large the piece of tile the more likely that it will crack due to it not being able to absorb the added stress of the flex of the surface area. The best tile to use would be the 1/2" thick porcelain tile like they use in a McDonalds kitchen or in most food processing facilities. That stuff is about a 6x6 tile and you could run a 45,000 pound tracked excavator over that stuff and not crack it. I have.

Something cracked the slab and a piece of 3/8 Porcelain is not going to hold it from further motion. Your luck is just holding out well against physics.

[Mr onetwo]

I ,too am going to do porcelain when I can afford it.In talking to my next door neighbor(he is a pro tile setter)He said don't do the Ditra or any other de-coupling membrane.They are a waste of money in this situation.Instead use Mapei Kerabond/Keralastic for your thinset.Search this site for more references about this product by a tile guy.I will also invest in Opticolor epoxy grout, but that may be overkill.

[mattthomas4444]

Im torn between flooring options for my garage. Id like to do tiles, but they might be expensive (havent looked into the cost for a two car garage yet) and also concrete staining. But my first choice would be tiles providing they arent too expensive. How easily does a creeper roll around or a tile floor?

Matt

[Dakota00]

Originally Posted by Mr onetwo

I ,too am going to do porcelain when I can afford it.In talking to my next door neighbor(he is a pro tile setter)He said don't do the Ditra or any other de-coupling membrane.They are a waste of money in this situation.Instead use Mapei Kerabond/Keralastic for your thinset.Search this site for more references about this product by a tile guy.I will also invest in Opticolor epoxy grout, but that may be overkill.

Your neighbor is a smart guy, I'm a tile setter too and I wouldn't use Ditra either. It's a waste of money. I also use Mapei Kerabond and Keralastic for thinset when doing exterior driveways or garage floors. I never had any problems with tiles popping or cracking. I would however advise against using epoxy grout as there is a more user friendly grout that is similar to epoxy made from Mapei called Ultracolor Plus grout.

[Jack Olsen]

Originally Posted by LegacyIndustrial

Jack:
You have guts going under that Porsche with those stands up like that.
I have my vette on the same stands, un-extended and I get uneasy. Yes I know my floor looks poor for a coating guy. The floors get done after I restore the vette!!

Nice Vette! That was a one-off using the stands like that. I was using a piece of aluminum to smooth out the underside of the car. Normally, I work under it with my (home-brewed) lift.

[ronstory]

Wow. A stealth lift. Very cool... I didn't notice the extra cuts in tile in the earlier post. I like it and great job.

Thanks,
Ron

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by Domochu

Hey guys,

Thanks for your input on my case. It is much appreciated that you take the time to write up your advices and I will consider them seriously.

Jack and slickgt1, I've seen how great your garage floors are and that's what inspired me to plan this project.

Frank, no suing will happen here. It is for myself. If it cracks, well...bummer for me. However, I'm trying to avoid that... and I guess that's the purpose of this forum's existence. To share knowledge about how to make it right. Thanks for your advice and I will seriously consider pinning down the part of my slab that has cracked.

I've seen Ditra before on this forum. I'm also questioning if it's really needed. We're looking at possibly doubling the cost of the project here with Ditra. It is about 2.50$ a sq.ft.

Not a problem.

Couple of things. If you look at my thread, my friend, who is a pro mason and tile installer was helping me with the mud job. He is the one the guided me all the way. I also had concern about the cracks coming through the tiles. He said don't worry, and don't use dirta. I was glad, because my tile was 1/3 the cost of the dirta. If dirta was needed, I would have gone with Race Deck.

Yes, epoxy grout is a bitch and a half to work with. I discovered it when renovating my house. I learned on smaller areas. Trick to it, is to leave a light film all over the tile and not try to rub it off, washing out the grout line. Problem is that you can't walk over the tile at all for a day. That film is not noticeable, but will be if you step into it with a dirty boot before it dries. Oh its super expensive. And you should be ready to throw out the gear you were wearing after you are done crawling on the floor applying it. Would I do it different next time though, no. I like the grime, oil, chemicals to stay on top of the grout, instead of going into it.

One of the main reasons for going with tile is because it was the cheapest and durable options.

Price was a major factor. I could not afford epoxy for a lot of reasons. Pro installation is the way to go, thick application. No way could I shell out $7 - $15 a square foot. Then on top of it, my floor was in no condition to coat, so I would have to fix it anyway. More $$$$. Then, I would have to move all my garage crap out to do epoxy. That's even more $$$. I'm in the city, pulling up a trailer and parking it conveniently in-front of the garage is never going to happen either. If I were to spend that kind of bread on epoxy, I would be treating it like a baby, which I did not want to do. I like to drag anything and everything on the floor. I'm a one man show in the garage, so if I can't lift, I'm dragging it. With 8' ceilings, I'm dragging stuff all the time anyway.

Race deck is nice. A ton of money too. Yea you can have it done in a couple of hours, but will it hold up to the abuse. I don't know, I can't see it holding up like this. Over the past month, my friends and I rebuilt a bimmer in there. So much oil and antifreeze hit the floor that its not even funny. If it all went under the RaceDeck I would kill myself. Saturday we got a bit of snow. I was out having fun with the truck. Next day when I opened the garage, my floor was a horrific mess from the melting snow, dirt from the truck, and whatever else dripped off. But it stayed on top of tile. I pulled out my hose, and squeegee, 3 minutes later floor looked new.

VCT would last a week in the garage, plus I don't want to be waxing, buffing, or any other maintenance on the floor.

Roll out mats, yea I have a friend that tried it. He turned his wheels on a sedan once in the garage. A shelf fell over and hit his car.

Sorry for the long post. Just wanted to share why I ended up with tile. Jack, pointed me to it. Then I did a ton of research, and came to my conclusion. I am so thrilled with it I don't mind typing up these long posts. I can't even count how many people walk past my garage and trip on their own feet because they can't get their eyes off it. lol.

So yea, don't over think it. Pin the moving, rocking, sections, get out the trowel and start tiling.

[Craftsman86]

I am a professional tile installer, and I have a great appreciation for the tiled garage floor, and done right it can be very durable. The only additions to the advise that was already given is:
1. Epoxy grout sucks use liquid latex in regular sanded grout and seal the living daylights out of it.
2. The hollow sounding concrete makes for hollow tile, your going to have to fix this or it will crack the tile that's all there is to it. Cut out all the bad cement and replace it (use a magnesium float to bring more "creme" to the surface of the patch) use sack-crete patch cement.
3. To ensure the maximum adhesion of the tile to the concrete pad (after patched) use a flex bond cement, and mix in liquid latex (same stuff you will use for your grout) with the mud. This allows for the optimum bond of the material to the sub-floor. Porcelain tile transfers energy very effectively when bonded correctly, you wont crack tiles by dropping a tool.
4. look into the number of layers of glaze on the surface of the tile, the more expensive the tile generally the more coats making for a much stronger tile.

[hdshinn]

I second the use of Ditra anti-fracture membrane. We've got close to 1000sf of Jura stone tile in our lower floor (living area, not garage) over 1 1/2" concrete fill that covers in floor radiant heating (PEX type) tubing. Before the tile was installed there were significant shrinkage cracks at every re-entrant corner. Three years and counting and none, absolutely none of these cracks have telegraphed through the tile. It's cheap insurance, in my opinion. It will not solve any problems related to on-going settlement of the slab, of course, but for a slab as old as yours I would expect it to resolve any horizontal movements associated with temperature or moisture.

[Craftsman86]

Originally Posted by hdshinn

I second the use of Ditra anti-fracture membrane. We've got close to 1000sf of Jura stone tile in our lower floor (living area, not garage) over 1 1/2" concrete fill that covers in floor radiant heating (PEX type) tubing. Before the tile was installed there were significant shrinkage cracks at every re-entrant corner. Three years and counting and none, absolutely none of these cracks have telegraphed through the tile. It's cheap insurance, in my opinion. It will not solve any problems related to on-going settlement of the slab, of course, but for a slab as old as yours I would expect it to resolve any horizontal movements associated with temperature or moisture.

If movement is a major concern, look for a product called Crack Buster Pro It is not the cheapest remedy, but it is guaranteed not to telegraph cracks

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by hdshinn

I second the use of Ditra anti-fracture membrane. We've got close to 1000sf of Jura stone tile in our lower floor (living area, not garage) over 1 1/2" concrete fill that covers in floor radiant heating (PEX type) tubing. Before the tile was installed there were significant shrinkage cracks at every re-entrant corner. Three years and counting and none, absolutely none of these cracks have telegraphed through the tile. It's cheap insurance, in my opinion. It will not solve any problems related to on-going settlement of the slab, of course, but for a slab as old as yours I would expect it to resolve any horizontal movements associated with temperature or moisture.

Different in your situation. And personally, still a waste of money. There are way around it, and has been done without for generations. But to each his own.

[ct71rr]

I'm going to be installing porcelain tiles in my garage, as well. Wont the weight of vehicles crush the Ditra?

[9GUY9]

I stumbled across these tiles at a great price. I was ready to order them last night. Until I calculated the shipping

http://www.builddirect.com/Porcelain..._10078080.aspx

700 square feet of tile is heavy.

[mws444]

Procelian tile is about the best for durability and looks, short of granite. a couple of words of advice:
Use DuraBond thinset, stuff is amazingly strong. In fact someone stepped on one during installation, the concrete actually gives before this thinset.
Make sure the setters get 100% coverage on the thinset, if they leave voids it will break, corners are the worse. Mine buttered both the floor and back of the tile.
Also try to keep them level, you can go with a 1/8" groutline if they are level.

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by ct71rr

I'm going to be installing porcelain tiles in my garage, as well. Wont the weight of vehicles crush the Ditra?

I also have that fear, so I have never tried it, and glad that I didn't.

How long have people being doing tile without Dirta? The mention of Dirta to my tile guy makes him laugh his ass off. He said that he can put down a mud job, and tile at the same time, while using dirta would essentially double the work.

It's really designed as a decoupler, which supposedly you can put right over plywood and other shifting flooring. I have a feeling it is for those that are too lazy to create a proper sub floor. Most don't like working with Duroc or Hardi boards either, so I can see a market for the Dirta.

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by 9GUY9

I stumbled across these tiles at a great price. I was ready to order them last night. Until I calculated the shipping

http://www.builddirect.com/Porcelain..._10078080.aspx

700 square feet of tile is heavy.

Holy crap. That is a great price for rectified PEI 5 tile. Call them up and see what the truck freight would be. Talk to them, maybe you can work something out. Again, that price is insane.

[Dakota00]

Originally Posted by ct71rr

I'm going to be installing porcelain tiles in my garage, as well. Wont the weight of vehicles crush the Ditra?

The vehicles weight will not crush the Ditra if installed properly. Like I said before Ditra is a great product but it's a waste of money on a concrete floor.

[SKULLY]

my budds porcelain tiled shop floor is a skating rink, slikkk as ice....darn near went arse ove tea kettle a few times....beer was always safe...FYI

[Domochu]

Just want to make sure I understand what you guys mean by pinning...

So the idea of "pinning" is to drive some re-bars vertically down in the section of the moving slab so it goes directly into the backfill? (See attached)

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by Domochu

Just want to make sure I understand what you guys mean by pinning...

So the idea of "pinning" is to drive some re-bars vertically down in the section of the moving slab so it goes directly into the backfill? (See attached)

Not exactly. You make the hole bigger than the rebar, About 3"-4" in diameter, bigger is ok. Put the rebar in, and then fill with concrete. You basically get a concrete rebar filled post.

[Domochu]

Originally Posted by slickgt1

Not exactly. You make the hole bigger than the rebar, About 3"-4" in diameter, bigger is ok. Put the rebar in, and then fill with concrete. You basically get a concrete rebar filled post.

So 3-4" diameter hole for 2 feet deep? So I dig out some of the backfill too, right? The slab must be about 4-5" thick

I start seeing the idea here. It's to make some 4" diameter by 2 feet long concrete pins reinforced by a rebar...

Thanks

EDIT: or 1 feet deep

[Infamous]

Originally Posted by 9GUY9

I stumbled across these tiles at a great price. I was ready to order them last night. Until I calculated the shipping

http://www.builddirect.com/Porcelain..._10078080.aspx

700 square feet of tile is heavy.

Originally Posted by slickgt1

Holy crap. That is a great price for rectified PEI 5 tile. Call them up and see what the truck freight would be. Talk to them, maybe you can work something out. Again, that price is insane.

They are crooks with the shipping. I asked if I could just pick it up in California and I will ship it myself to NY. They wanted 3600 to ship $800 worth of tile..

[9GUY9]

Originally Posted by Infamous

They are crooks with the shipping. I asked if I could just pick it up in California and I will ship it myself to NY. They wanted 3600 to ship $800 worth of tile..

WOW! My quote to MN was $600. I asked if I could pick it up at the ware house in CA and they said no.

I sent a email to one of the sales reps saying I would love to buy the tile if they could do better on shipping.

I got a sample of the tile. It is very nice and a great color for a garage. About 2500 more free samples and I could do the whole garage

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by Domochu

So 3-4" diameter hole for 2 feet deep? So I dig out some of the backfill too, right? The slab must be about 4-5" thick

I start seeing the idea here. It's to make some 4" diameter by 2 feet long concrete pins reinforced by a rebar...

Thanks

EDIT: or 1 feet deep

I went 1 foot minimum, tried for two feel. So as close as possible. And yes, take out the backfill too. I used a shop vac.

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by Infamous

They are crooks with the shipping. I asked if I could just pick it up in California and I will ship it myself to NY. They wanted 3600 to ship $800 worth of tile..

Damn crooks. I can ship a car from California to NYC for $400.

[84944Redline]

Originally Posted by Infamous

They are crooks with the shipping. I asked if I could just pick it up in California and I will ship it myself to NY. They wanted 3600 to ship $800 worth of tile..

Originally Posted by 9GUY9

I stumbled across these tiles at a great price. I was ready to order them last night. Until I calculated the shipping

http://www.builddirect.com/Porcelain..._10078080.aspx

700 square feet of tile is heavy.

That is a nice looking tile for a garage floor. I got in a few samples to see how they look in person and am considering to use. The only concern I have is how slick they are when wet. The other samples I received (Takla Montana) are definitely more slip-resistant. The problem with those is the high price when factoring in shipping.

With the clearance price of the one tile and adding in shipping, it still isn't too bad a deal. Just not sure how excited I am about buying online and wondering what the delivery service will be like. Moving almost 100 boxes of tile isn't quick and easy!

[slickgt1]

I still recommend people checking their local stores for clearances. I've seen tile go cheap at times.

[NewShockerGuy]

Good thread... My main question is when you put tile down on the garage floor how are you making it even with the front of the garage coming into the garage? IE: Normally there is a little bit of a lip coming into the garage so that water doesn't go into the garage... by adding tile on TOP of the garge it would make it that much higher... how does one avoid this if any? I like the pictures of the tile but have never seen what it looks like looking into the garage from the driveway....

Also when adding tile where do you start? Middle of the room, pick a corner, side..etc?

-Nigel

[slickgt1]

I purchased SS Steel tile edge protector, and installed it instead of the lip. Protects that tile edge like no other. I also installed a garage door rubber threshold in front of that lip. So my car goes on the threshold first, then over the lip. Incline from threshold to top of tile is no more than 1/4".

From the outside. Major renovation done here.


From edge, outside. Sorry both pics are still during the major work, and everything is dirty. Look in the pics between the Hilti box and the compound bucket, you can see the cut-offs from the edge protector. I use aluminum everywhere else, like the step, and sewer cover. Much cheaper. Each one of those SS 10' pieces were like $20 to $30 each. I forgot exactly, but remember that my eyes bulged when I heard the price. I was on a tight budget.




Let me know if get the gist of it or if you want better pics.

You can buy that at the bix box stores, but they usually only have the aluminum ones. I chose SS because it is much more durable, especially when you driving and dragging stuff over the edge. Which I do all the time.

[Domochu]

Hey slickgt1,

Thanks for your contribution to this thread. The SS edge is a great idea. However, you mentioned about a rubber threshold but it doesn't seem to figure on the pics you posted...Is it just me or it is not on the pics?

[slickgt1]

Originally Posted by Domochu

Hey slickgt1,

Thanks for your contribution to this thread. The SS edge is a great idea. However, you mentioned about a rubber threshold but it doesn't seem to figure on the pics you posted...Is it just me or it is not on the pics?

It is just messed up dirty. It's in front of the tile. You can see it in both pics. The pic with the bimmer in the garage, you can see it cleaned up. The black line in front of the tile. The pic with the doors, it's there too. But covered up in dirt, and cement, and all other shit from the renovation.

[aosty]

Originally Posted by Jack Olsen

Oh, and here's a picture that showed the first half of my garage right before I put down my tiles. There was about an inch and a half drop off in that front section, where a previous owner had lengthened the garage. I didn't know about self-leveling mix when I did this, so I used vinyl patching mix.

Hi Jack - Do you have a photo of the cracks and drop prior to patching? I live nearby and in the process of buying a house with a garage floor in similar sounding condition... questioning the sanity of patching/filling the area. Thanks.

[PecosBill]

As usual, I'm coming late to this party. You do not want to use a uncoupling membrane, like Ditra, on a garage floor, but it is a good idea to use a crack-isolation membrane, such as Mapei's Mapelastic 315, Aquadefence, or HPG. These membranes allow a small amount of movement, without transfering the load through the tile. This, used in conjunction with a flexible mortar system like Keralastic/Kerabond, or GraniRapid, makes for a long lasting tile installation over concrete. Go with a grout system like either Mapei's Opticolor, or Laticrete's Spectralock, and you will save yourself some grout maintenance down the road.

Just remember, no matter what you do, do not bridge expansion, control, or cold joints. These are all designed to move more than any crack-isolation or uncoupling membrane can control. There are joint systems designed to deal with these through the tile.

Someone mentioned 6x6 tiles used in commercial kitchens as being porcelain, but they are not, they are quarry tile. These are not as durable as porcelain, but that being said, they have been used for decades in European manufacturing settings, and even garages. They do get beat up, but they actually look pretty cool after a few decades of wear and patina.